Turkey Video Special: Prime Minister Erdogan's 50 Minutes on US Television (29 June)

Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan in a lengthy interview with Charlie Rose on the US Public Broadcasting Service. The video is in five parts, starting at the 6:30 mark of Part 1. The transcript is available on the Charlie Rose website:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agelslQBWuM[/youtube]

Turkey Inside Line: Israel’s Unmanned Planes, Iran’s Uranium, Trouble with the EU, and More

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELNl_fQuNew[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOx7g9Wj0ko[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CQoKhT4lF8[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNZ9ujbkbb4[/youtube]

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: We had in Turkey some problems in the beginning of the millennium and also in the 1990s, too. When we came to government, we were very much aware of the difficulty and challenges, and we took certain steps. And in the seven and a half years in government, we have been standing firmly on our feet in this financial sector and the economy in general.

Turkey is not a country where everyone and anyone can establish a bank as they please, for example. They have to have a good basis to establish a bank, for example, because otherwise if we were to allow things as they were in the past, we would be having more problems, crises as we had in the past.

So we worked very hard and we never reverted to populism. We were a very determined in the way that we worked in the economic front. And despite all of the difficulties around the world, Turkey has been working to repay the loan from the IMF. We were very determined in reducing our debt to the IMF, and we reduced it from $23.5 billion to $7 billion.
And we had $26.5 billion in reserves and our central banks whereas now
we have $72.5 billion in reserve in the central bank. So those are -- this
is the kind of development that has taken place.

And throughout the process we have not had any banks taken over by the
government. In the past, 21 banks had to be taken over the government in
previous crises. So we did not have that problem. And our private sector,
our business people have also learn to stand on their own feet.

We had some problems in 2008-2009, but in the first quarter of this
year, we started maintaining a level of growth which we had achieved in the
last quarter of last year. And according to IMF estimates, Turkey is
expected to grow about six percent this year, which goes to show that
Turkey has been quite successful, indeed.

CHARLIE ROSE: It also suggests to many people that the changing
economic picture and the changing political picture have given you an
opportunity to play a larger role. So the question is, what does Turkey
want to do?

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Well, I have to say that we do not see the
economy as our only area of concentration. Democracy has been very
important for us, too. We tried to carry on with developments in both
fields.

In any case, you can’t really fully succeed if you don’t take both
hand in hand. Democracy, democratic development and economic development
have to go hand in hand, because if you do one, then the other one will be
successful. If not, then there will be problems.

And during our tenure in government, we have seen a lot of development
in fundamental rights and freedoms. We really achieved a lot in that
regard.

And there are two basic concept which is we always paid attention to.
One was stability and the other one was security, because if you don’t have
security in a country, if you don’t have stability in a country, then no
investments will come to that country. And when you have no investments,
you cannot create employment. When you have no employment, you cannot
produce. And when you have no production then you cannot be successful
overall.

So we focus on peace, stability, prosperity and we have been working
to achieve these three, and this is what we have been doing. And we carry
the same determination looking into the future.

And the state, the government has moved out of the economic field of
activity and this has been transferred to the private sector. We’ve been
very successful in that.

There are still some sectors where the state is still involved, but we
are slowly taking the state out of these sectors. So the state will play a
monitoring, guiding role only. It will not be an actor in the various
sectors.

This has been important in trying to achieve peace, prosperity,
welfare in Turkey, and that was our goal. And we’re about to achieve this
goal. There’s some problems, but we’re trying to overcome them.

CHARLIE ROSE: You have a higher growth rate than some of the other
countries who are already in the European Union, as you well know. Some
have suggested you no longer have the same passion to become part of the
European Union, that your eyes are looking in another direction.

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Well, let me be very clear and specific here.
We have not been able to overcome the prejudice that the European Union has
vis-a-vis Turkey. Some EU member states -- I say some, because there are
also countries where members of EU who are friends of Turkey. But then
there are also other members who really cannot fit in Turkey in their own
minds.

We on the other hand have been doing our homework and we have been
successful in doing our homework. But some countries are blocking some
chapters in the accession talks from being open. They’re not being very
honest. These countries are not being very honest and open.

But we are very determined and we continue along this path. Turkey
applied to the European Union in 1959. We are in year 2010, 51 years have
passed. And this has not been the case for any country. And if you look
at the body of legislation that the EU has, there have been things that
have been asked of Turkey which does not exist in that body of legislation,
and they are trying to invent rules as the game is being played.

And this is what we have to overcome. And there are certain issues,
problems here. But in the steps that we take with regard to the opinion,
we have not had a change of heart or mind. We are as determined as we
were.

CHARLIE ROSE: You want to be part of Europe and you will meet with
President Sarkozy, you’ll meet with Chancellor Merkel and you’ll say "We
want to be part of Europe, don’t believe anything that suggests otherwise."

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Well, when we speak of being part of Europe,
what do Mr. Sarkozy and Mrs. Merkel mean? Is it geographically,
economically, or any other way?

If we look at this from a geographic point of view, Turkey is part of
Europe and Turkey is part of Asia as well, geographically speaking. Now
culturally, if that is the interpretation, then I think there’s no question
that Turkey is a part of Europe. Turkey’s taken many steps, and, for
example, at the moment there are five million Turks living in EU member
states. Turkey is a member of NATO.

And Turkey is taking upon itself a great burden, too, in many ways, in
the various institutions that it’s a part of. So it’s very strange,
comical, in fact, to speak of it like this.

CHARLIE ROSE: Secretary Gates said if, in fact, Turkey is looking in
a new place, it’s because they were not given an opportunity to participate
in the European Union and they were -- changed their minds because of that.
You just say "Secretary Gates, it’s not true. Nothing has changed because
of my effort to join the European Union."

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: I’ll give you a very interesting answer. When
this statement was made by Mr. Gates, Mr. Barroso was also making
statement. And Mr. Barroso was saying -- while Mr. Gates was saying what
you just said -- that it was the United States, it was the policy approach
of the United States which has made Turkey shift its position.

Look, let me tell you this Turkey cannot be described by what the EU
has said or by what Mr. Gates has said. Nobody should worry. Turkey is
very much aware of its historical responsibility, its geographical
location, and looks to the future in that way.

How does the U.S. look and see the world? The U.S. or the Americans
come to central Asia, they make investments there, they go to the gulf or
to the Islamic countries and talk to all these countries. Is this normal?
It’s normal. It’s usual.

Western countries, they go to all these countries, they make
investments there, they have export/imports with all these countries all
over the world. So why would anyone think it unusual when Turkey does
this?

You can see some western products, German, French products in Iran or
U.S. products or Russian products. This is considered normal. So why is
it not so not normal or unusual when it’s Turkey? In the same in the
Islamic world, in the Arab world, the same thing is true there.

So when other countries do it or has investments with those countries
it’s very usual. When Turkey does it, why is it considered unusual? We
have relationships with Europe. We have western countries which have made
investments in Turkey. So why would one consider them as being out of the
ordinary?

I think we have to be very frank there is no question of any shift in
our axis. Turkey continues to proceed along the path it has been on, and
this is a very normal process. We say that the river flows and follows its
bed. And this determination and aim of Turkey has always been to achieve
modern contemporary standards.

And there’s no shift whatsoever as far as that object is concerned.
We talk to the north, east, west, south, we talk to everyone around the
world because we’re a country of the world.

CHARLIE ROSE: The other argument is that there’s a new northern tier
-- you’ve heard this before -- and Turkey is the leader of it, or plays an
important role, Turkey, Iran, Iraq, Syria.

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: This is a very wrong approach. There are many
international organizations, arrangements that we are a part of. As I said
earlier, we’re a member of NATO. We’re a member of the OECD we are an
accession country to the European Union. We are part of the Black Sea
Economic Cooperation. We are a member of the OIC, the Organization of
Islamic conversation.

So we have many relations, and we are not engaged in any sort of
effort to try to create another set of a different kind of relations. But
I don’t understand why people would be so envious of Turkey developing such
relations because, after all, these countries which you list are
neighboring countries to Turkey, and nothing could be more natural than
Turkey to establish relations with neighboring countries.

In the past we had what was called an RCD. This was the case of
countries in that area working together. The RCD is not as active as it
was in the past, but what is being done as far as that should not be
disturbing anyone.

For example, we reached an agreement in the Caucasus which included
Russia, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, and Turkey, so five countries. In
the same way we have relations with countries in the Mediterranean and the
Middle East, and quite naturally so because of Turkey’s location. We are
engaged in cooperation with these countries.

So there is nothing beyond that. And no one should be worrying about
this.

CHARLIE ROSE: I don’t think they’re worrying about it. I think
they’re just recognizing the changing power reality of the world, which is
happening across the world. China and India is much stronger. Turkey is
much stronger.

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: Well, I think we have to say that we should
consider which angle we take -- political, economic, cultural.

If you look at the situation from all these angles, we see change in
all of them. Politically speaking, if we are looking for from a political
angle, we can say that, of course, there are many international
organizations where Turkey is a member.

Economically speaking, Turkey has an important place in the
competitive global economy. And we aim to continue to develop our economic
activity.

And I should say that we need to work with many countries around the
world in order to increase our competitiveness and to do -- and so we have
to do business in different countries. We look at Latin American
countries, tens of thousands of miles away and we’re trying to do business
with other parts of the world.

For example, Turkey has been a neighbor with Russia for many years but
we didn’t have much economic relations to speak of with Russia. But we
reached a trade volume of $35 billion in 2008, and we had last year $23.5
billion of trade with the Russians despite the economic crisis.

And our trade with the U.S. is quite low now but even when it was at
its highest, it stood around $10 billion, but $10. But then $20 billion or
$30 billion, this is a very small amount. We have to go much beyond that.
We’re trying to do the same with China, and we will do it, we will work
with all the far eastern countries as well.

And I don’t understand how or why people interpret this effort in a
different way, because no matter what culture, where people come from, we
visit these places with our business people. The African continent, South
America, Latin America, we travel to all of these locations, to the Far
East.

We will be going to all these countries. We have to do that because
otherwise we cannot increase our exports. At its best, Turkey’s exports
stands at $132 billion. Of course, when we came the government it was $36
billion. It has grown but we have to keep going. If we cannot grow it,
then we will have problems.

When we have business, our exports, our employment will not be a
problem. We had at one point our unemployment reach 16 percent. It’s
going down now. It’s now down to 13 percent. Our goal is to reduce the
unemployment rate to 10 percent.

If you look at European countries we see the unemployment rate going
up while in Turkey it’s going down, and that’s the result of the work which
I just explained to you.

On the other hand, we’re moving from a more agricultural society to a
more industrialized society, so there’s a lot of challenge there. We are
moving from a labor-intensive economy to a technology-intensive economy.
And of course in a technology intensive economy you won’t find as many
employment opportunities as you would find in the labor intensive society.
So we have to work very hard.

CHARLIE ROSE: Granted, you have this economic power. There are those
who will say that Turkey has taken over the mantle of being the best friend
of Palestinians in the region.

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: I think that this interpretation alone is not
exactly right. We are friends with all the countries in the region. We
have no problems with any of the countries in the region. We are a friend
to Israel as well in this region.

Just two days ago there was a meeting, a summit in Turkey of the
southeast European countries. So Turkey is in contact with many countries.
In the Middle East we’re friends with Israel as well.

But more recently because of the position Israel has taken and also
because they attacked in international waters three ships where there were
Turkish citizens from the air and from the sea, this has creates a
difficulty because there’s no explanation to this situation, to this
incident. It cannot be explained by international law.

This is state terror. It would be impossible to define it in any
international legal terms. In one of the ships, there were volunteers, and
the other two ships had toys, food, medicine, construction material, et
cetera, humanitarian aid.

And the attack came from the sea and from the air, and there were
plastic bullets used, guns used. Nine people died, eight of them Turkish,
one a U.S. citizen. The American citizen, the U.S. administration should
take ownership of this situation because there was an American citizen
involved.

We as the Turkish government do the same because the families have a
right to ask their government what has happened. That’s what they do.
They ask us, why? Why what has happened, happened? What about my husband
or my son? And the same thing is true for all countries. And we will act
within international law, taking into consideration the medical reports.

Now, in Palestine is America working to achieve peace? Yes. The
other countries, the quartet, they’re all working. Why was the quartet
established? To achieve peace. And we are a country of that region. And
what could be more natural than Turkey, a regional country, working to
achieve peace?

CHARLIE ROSE: Turkey has been a friend of Israel, has had a very good
relationship with Israel. It helped try to bridge a relationship with
Syria, between Israel and Syria. What’s the status of that relationship
today?

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: At the moment the problem in Israel is the
coalition government. The coalition government is the biggest barrier to
peace.

Secondly, with regard to the problems between Syria and Israel, Syria
is also waiting to see what Israel will want to do, because Syria is ready
to start with those talks again. It’s what Israel is going to say --

CHARLIE ROSE: And you’re prepared to be involved in those talks
again?

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: If the parties ask us to be involved we would
be, yes, prepared to work for peace. And we’ve said this before. But, of
course, the parties must be interested.

CHARLIE ROSE: So if Syria is prepared to talk to Israel through you
and if Israel is prepared to talk to Syria through you, you’re prepared to
do it, unlike when you broke it off because of the Gaza invasion?

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN: As long as the parties involved ask and request

Gaza Flotilla Analysis: US Official Position "My Israel, Right or Wrong" (Yenidunya)

U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Tuesday that "the situation in Gaza is unsustainable and unacceptable". However, when she turned from the "humanitarian side" of the issue, she emphasised: "Israel’s legitimate security needs must be met."

Translated: We are sorry for some Gazans who are suffering from the blockade but Israel needs to continue its struggle against Hamas and we do support this cause.

Gaza Flotilla LiveBlog (3 June): Pressure on Israel Grows

(Clinton also did not emphasize the need of an international investigation. On Tuesday, Israel's ambassador to the U.S., Michael Oren, was offered an investigation led by an "international" judge as a chair with a US representative as an observer. West Jerusalem has not responded.)


On Wednesday, Vice President Joe Biden, appearing on the US Public Broadcasting Service, put all the blame on Hamas and said, "I think Israel has an absolute right to deal with its security interest". As for the enquiry, he opened the door for West Jerusalem, "Well, an investigation run by the Israelis, but we're open to international participation..."

Here is a part of the transcript of Biden's interview:

Charlie Rose: Prime Minister Netanyahu was scheduled to come to Washington. He did not. He went back to Israel. There is a blockade. Should they end the blockade in lieu of what's happened here?

Joe Biden: I think Israel has an absolute right to deal with its security interest. I put all this back on two things: one, Hamas, and, two, Israel's need to be more generous relative to the Palestinian people who are in trouble in Gaza. Let me explain that very briefly. Sometimes, because we deal so much at least which you know so much about, we have to remember how we got here. Remember, it was Ehud Barak who decided to pull all Iraqi troops --- I mean, excuse me, all Iraqi --- all Israeli troops out of Gaza. He did that back in '06.

Then there was an election, an election for their Parliament with a president named Mahmoud Abbas who in fact was the successor of [Yasser] Arafat in the Fatah [Party]. That produced a majority of members of the Parliament, which was the West Bank and Gaza, of Hamas.

The international community, the so-called Quartet; the United States, Europe, Russia, and the U.N., said, "Look, in order for you to be part of that government, you have to agree to four conditions. One, you'll abide by previous agreements that have been made by the government of --- by the Palestinians. Two, you are going to renounce terror. Three, you're going to recognize Israel, and basically that you have to accept” --- and here's what happened. They then got in a fight among themselves. They physically took over by force of arms, killed members of the existing government, exile them, took over and started firing rockets into Israel. Over 3,000 went in last year.

And as we put pressure, and the world put pressure on Israel to let material go into Gaza to help those people who are suffering, the ordinary Palestinians there, what happened? Hamas would confiscate it, put it in a warehouse, sell it, they were -- so the problem is this would end tomorrow if Hamas agreed to form a government with the Palestinian Authority on the conditions the international community has set up.

And so I mean again, look, you can argue whether Israel should have dropped people onto that ship or not and the -- but the truth of the matter is, Israel has a right to know --- they're at war with Hamas --- has a right to know whether or not arms are being smuggled in. And up to now,

Charlie, what's happened? They've said, "Here you go. You're in the Mediterranean. This ship --- if you divert slightly north you can unload it and we'll get the stuff into Gaza." So what's the big deal here? What's the big deal of insisting it go straight to Gaza? Well, it's legitimate for Israel to say, "I don't know what's on that ship. These guys are dropping eight --- 3,000 rockets on my people." Now, the one thing we have to do is not forget the plight of these Palestinians there, not Hamas, the --- they're in bad shape. So we have put as much pressure and as much cajoling on Israel as we can to allow them to get building materials in, glass....

Charlie Rose: That's what they're trying to bring in, building materials.

Joe Biden: Yes, we know that, but they could have easily brought it in here and we'd get it through. And so now the question is what do we do? Well, we had made it clear, the President of the United States has spoken three times, yesterday with Bibi, or the day before yesterday, he's spoken once yesterday with a guy that I have spent a fair amount of time with, with Prime Minister Erdogan in Turkey; the Turks, we passed a resolution in the U.N. saying we need a transparent and open investigation of what happened. It looks like things are ---

Charlie Rose: International investigation ---

Joe Biden: Well, an investigation run by the Israelis, but we're open to international participation, just like the investigation run on the sunken sub in -- off the coast of Korea. That was run by South Korea, but the international community joined in that investigation. And so that is very possible here as well. I might add by the way for all those who say the Israelis, you know, you know, you can't trust them, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled today that every one of the people on those ships had to be released immediately, immediately.

Charlie Rose: So what's the ---

Joe Biden: It's a rule of law. It works.

Charlie Rose: I said it was my last question, so I'll make it my last question then. So are you saying that the relationship between Israel and the United States is okay, that there are ---

Joe Biden: It's more than okay. Look, we always have had disagreements tactically with the Israeli government, but when I was in Israel, Bibi Netanyahu and I held a press conference before all the flap about a new settlement, etc, and ---

Charlie Rose: Right, yeah, yeah. Exactly, oh, the President got very upset about that because of what he did while you were in the country. I mean, that was the ---

Joe Biden: That's true but here's the point. We stood there at that press conference I'm making a major speech at the University of Tel Aviv, major meaning laying out U.S. policy, and Bibi pointed out that no administration in history has been as up-front and supportive of Israel's security as this administration. We've done everything from provide missile defense. We've made sure they've maintained their qualitative edge. There's a new program they call Iron Dome that we're helping fund for them to be able to protect themselves. We have joint maneuvers. They've never been closer on the strategic side with Israel than today.